香港大公报和大公网记者：我有两个问题，第一个问题问国土部的王部长，我们注意到外部有一些声音，说新型城镇化有可能引起新一轮的“圈地运动”，在增加城市的新的土地供给和农民的合法权益的平衡之间会做哪些工作？另外想问一下徐主任，我们也非常想知道，很多投资者想知道在新型城镇化的投资机会，尤其是香港企业具备的高端服务业的投资机会，您能不能帮我们介绍一下？谢谢。
Hong
Kong Takungpao and its affiliated website: I have two questions. The first
one is for Vice Minister Wang Shiyuan from the Ministry of Land and Resources.
We have noticed that some voices out there have claimed that the new
urbanization will initiate a new round of “Enclosure Movement.” Between
increasing land supply in cities and ensuring farmer’s rights, what kind of
work will be done to balance out both?
My second question goes to Xu,
vice minister of the National Development and Reform Commission (NDRC). Many
investors are eager to learn more about the investment opportunities in the new
urbanization round, especially for the high-end service sector that Hong Kong
companies take pride in. Could you brief us about such opportunities? Thank
you.
王世元：首先感谢你对土地管理和耕地保护工作的关注。我先介绍一下，在城镇化规划编制过程中，我们作为成员单位确实参与了《规划》的编制、论证工作。比如我们利用第二次全国土地调查的数据成果，及时提供了规划所需要采用的土地基础数据，因为这个时间段正好合拍。第二是我们共同测算了2020年规划期城市建设的规模，特别是城市人均建设规模一百平方米的规划目标。第三是同步开展了规划编制中涉及土地管理改革方面的政策研究，我们开展了一系列政策研究，在这个基础上，及时提供了7个方面27条的政策建议，应该说对《规划》给予了有力支撑。
Wang
Shiyuan:
First of all, I want to thank you for your concern about land management and
the protection of arable land. In the compilation process of urbanization plan,
we as a member did participate in the drafting and reviewing. For example, we
gathered the data taken from the second national land survey (July 1, 2007 -
Dec. 31, 2009) and used it as basic data in the compilation, largely because
the drafting work happened to appear at the same time.
Secondly, we have jointly
predicted the urbanization scale for 2020, especially the planned objective to
have the per-capita construction scale reach 100 square meters.
On a third note, at the same
time, we conducted policy research regarding reforms in land management, which
would concern the urbanization plan. On this basis, we offered 27 suggestions,
gathered from seven different perspectives, to facilitate the policymaking. It
is fair to say our work has strongly backed up the new urbanization planning.
当前和今后一个时期，按照党中央最近一个时期对土地管理工作的一系列要求，大家知道，三中全会之后的中央经济工作会议、城镇化工作会议、农村工作会议，对土地管理都有新的要求。按照这个要求，在促进和推进城镇化发展过程当中，我们重点要抓好三个方面工作的落实：
The CPC Central Committee
recently issued a series of requirements for land management undertakings. As
you know, after the Party’s Third Plenum, the Central Economic Work Conference,
Urbanization Conference and Rural Work Conference all raised new requirements
for land management efforts. Following the new requirements, we will focus on
the work from three aspects:
第一，将保护耕地作为城镇化发展的基础和前提，始终坚持最严格的耕地保护制度，坚持耕地保护优先、数量和质量并重的原则。当下我们正在会同有关部门探索经济社会发展、城市规划和土地利用总体规划“多规合一”的试点，也就是依据第二次全国土地调查成果，合理调整土地利用总体规划。在空间上做好与相关规划的衔接，这个《规划》就是底盘，将资源生态、基本农田、城市边界这三个底盘画出来，将红线划出来。严格控制建设用地的发展规模，确实需要发展的，要按照串联式、组团式、卫星城市的布局来发展，这样既有利于保护优质耕地，也能够起到生态保护的功能。下一步，我们要逐步减少新增建设用地计划指标。2014年我们跟发改委商量，可能这个年度计划指标要有所下降，重点控制东部地区，尤其是京津冀、长三角、珠三角三个城市群的新增建设用地规模。刚才徐主任讲了，这些城市群还是要立足于内涵挖潜，中小城市发展空间还是比较大的。同时我们还要建立健全耕地保护目标责任制，把这个制度进一步完善起来。还要建立更加完善的占补平衡制度，加强高标准的基本农田建设。通过以上工作，无论是守住耕地红线、保护现有耕地数量和质量基本稳定都会产生积极的效果。
At present, we are working
together with other government agencies to pilot the consolidation of
regulations that apply to economic and social development, urban planning and
land use, which in turn means that we are modifying the overall land use
planning based on the second national land census.
We will connect all related
regulations to the urbanization plan, which would work as a foundation for all
regulations. The plan marks all boundaries of the ecological resources,
farmlands and city areas with red lines. The scale of the new construction
lands would be under strictly control. Cities that need more space should
expand their urban area in a linear layout with combined conglomeration and
form a satellite town. This will ensure the protection of both farmland and the
ecosystem.
Our next step is to gradually
reduce the planned quota for new construction land. After consulting the NDRC,
we will reduce the quota for 2014, with a priority to control the country’s
eastern areas, especially those new urban spaces in cluster cities in the
Beijing-Tianjin-Hebeiarea, the Yangtze Delta and the Pearl River Delta.
As Vice Minister Xu just
mentioned, in developing these cities, we will continue to excavate their full
potential as there is still much room left for the development of small and
medium cities in these areas. At the same time, we will establish and improve
the responsibility system for farmland protection without neglecting the
balance between both the use and retrieval of farmland.
Through the abovementioned
efforts, there will be positive results in protecting arable land, both in
terms of quality and quantity.
第二，将节约集约用地作为推进城镇化转型发展的关键和核心任务。要始终坚持最严格的节约用地制度，进一步提高城镇建设用地的效率。按照中央提出的控制增量，盘活存量，优化结构，提升效率的要求，创新土地管理制度，优化土地利用结构。在挖掘存量用地上，重点是城镇村低效用地再开发，提高土地利用强度，完善各类用地标准，建立存量建设用地的退出机制。包括城镇工业用地、农村的宅基地以及其他建设用地，要有鼓励和激励的退出机制。我们还要规范土地整治和城乡建设用地增减挂钩的平台，来提高农村土地利用的效率。以土地的节约集约利用，来促进城镇化转型发展，着力提升城镇土地对人口、产业的集聚吸纳能力，以此来提高城镇化的发展质量。
Following then, we must view land
conservation and the intensive use of land as a key and critical task in
driving forward urbanization development. We will always abide by the strictest
regulations in land conservation to further raise the efficiency of land use in
urban construction.
By following the central
government’s demands, in controlling the increase in land supply, making the
most of the present stock of land, optimizing the land structure and raising
the land use efficiency, we will innovate land management system.
In checking the inventory of
land, the key lies in the redevelopment of “low efficiency land” in rural towns
and villages to improve the intensity of land use. We should refine the
standards for various types of land. We shall establish an incentive and
encouraging mechanism for non-arable lands to exit, including the land allocated
to urban area, the land destined for industry development, rural homesteads and
other construction purposes.
We will also standardize land
remediation to improve the efficiency of rural land use. Based on land
conservation and the intensive use of land, we will promote urbanization which
in turn improves the attraction of rural townships to both workforce and
industries.
第三，将维护农民合法权益作为以人为本推进城镇化的出发点和落脚点，慎重稳妥推进农村土地制度改革，同时深化城市的土地使用制度改革。当前国土资源部正在紧锣密鼓地会同相关部委研究制定改革总体方案和试点方案，这其中包括国有土地怎么深化改革，怎么扩大使用范围。
Third, we should regard the
preservation of farmers’ lawful rights as our fundamental purpose in developing
people-oriented urbanization. We should prudently advance the reform of the
rural land system while deepening the reform in the urban land system.
The Ministry of Land and
Resources is joining hands with other government organs in setting an overall
agenda for reform and pilot proposals. This would include how to deepen the
reform of state-owned land and how to expand its different uses.
对于集体土地，要坚持农村土地集体所有、坚守耕地保护红线、维护农民权益，在符合规划和用途管制的前提下，允许集体经营性建设用地来入市，同时要在完善征地制度、宅基地使用制度等方面，提出改革的政策措施。
For the land with collective
ownership in rural parts, we should adhere to such ownership and the protection
red lines of the arable land and stick up to the rights and interests of
farmers. Under the precondition of legitimacy in city planning and land use
regulations, we will allow commercial land with collective ownership to enter
the land market. Apart from that, we will release reform measures for land
requisition and the use of land for homesteads.
我想，通过这些制度改革和措施，切实抓好落实，我们就能做到既保证新型城镇化发展的合理用地，又能保障粮食安全和农民的权益。谢谢大家。
Now that we have outlined these
reforms and measures, I think that as long as we can strictly implement them,
we can ensure reasonable land use in new urbanization development while at the
same time safeguard the country’s food security and farmers’ rights and
interests.
Thank you.
徐宪平：我回答您第二个问题。服务业与城镇化密切相关。城镇不断集聚经济和人口，就需要提供生产性服务，也要提供生活性服务。生产性服务业，如融资服务、科技研发服务、中介服务等行业；生活性服务业，如医疗、健康、养老等行业。去年我国服务业占比46.1%，发达国家普遍在70%多，相比之下，差距还较大，所以服务业还有较大发展空间。在推进新型城镇化过程中，我们欢迎香港企业参与大陆服务业的发展。我们也会不断扩大服务业对内对外开放。谢谢。
Xu
Xianping: Please
allow me to answer your second question. The service sector is closely related
to urbanization. As cities and towns are gathering growth in both their economy
and population, there will be a rising demand for production services -- such
as financing, scientific development and intermediary services -- as well as
life-related services, including medical service, healthcare and senior care.
Last year, the service sector
accounted for 46.1 percent of China’s overall economy. But in developed
countries, this proportion is usually higher than 70 percent. This gap means
there is still much room for the development of the service sector in China.
In boosting new urbanization,
Hong Kong companies are welcomed to participate in the development of the
service sector on the mainland. We will continue to open up this sector to
international investors. Thank you.
中新社记者：城镇化过程中的住房问题，想问一下住建部的齐部长。大城市的高房价会不会成为阻碍城镇化的因素？如何确保农民工在城里能够买得起房？针对不同类型的城市，有没有哪些措施是予以保障的？
China
News Service (CNS): I
would like to ask Vice Minister Qi some questions about housing in the process
of urbanization. Will the high housing prices found in the big cities become an
obstacle for urbanization? How can we ensure that rural migrant workers can
afford housing in the cities? Do we have different measures for different types
of cities?
齐骥：你关注的是新型城镇化过程中的住房问题。刚才杨部长就农民工进城如何乐业，怎么帮助他们乐业，谈了他对规划的理解。我们常说，安居才能乐业，所以在新型城镇化过程中，对新的市民，包括农民，如何解决他们的安居问题，做出了安排。这次解读新型城镇化规划，涉及到住房问题，建议大家格外关注规划中的两点：第一点，对落户农民要实现住房保障的全覆盖。这是一个提法，换句话讲，符合落户城市住房保障条件的农民家庭全部纳入到住房保障范围，当然保障方式是多样的。第二点大家也是十分关注的，就是要逐步实现基本公共服务常住人口全覆盖，涉及到住房是什么意思？我给大家解释一下。
Qi Ji: Your questions
concern housing problems during the process of implementing the new
urbanization plan. Minister Yang has just elaborated on the issue of how to
help migrant workers work to their satisfaction, and talked about his
understanding of the plan. We often say, “When one lives well, then one can
truly settle down and enjoy his job.” Therefore we need to ensure that the new
urban residents and rural migrant workers can truly find a place to live in the
urban areas. I’d like to call your attention to two points in the National Plan which discuss housing for
rural migrant workers.
The first one is to ensure the
full coverage of basic housing for rural migrant workers. In other words, all
migrant families eligible for the housing guarantee system in the cities they
move in will be covered by the system. There will be various categories of
assurance available. The second thing I believe you may also be interested in,
is to gradually realize the universal coverage of basic public services for the
permanent population in urban areas.
我刚才讲的第一个大家的关注点，是进城落户的农民，在住房保障体系中要实现全覆盖。第二个讲的是基本公共服务当然也包括基本的住房保障，或者叫基本住房方面的公共服务，要把常住人口全覆盖。这个意思就是讲，无论你是落户还是不落户，只要在城市长期工作，换句话说已经基本上定居了，但是他没有得到城市的户籍，对这部分群体也要实现基本公共服务全覆盖。这两个新提法，是在新型城镇化规划当中涉及到城镇居民及常住人口住房问题的两个新政策。
It means that those who work
permanently in cities, with or without a city hukou, will all be entitled to enjoy basic public services. Of
course, the basic public services include a guarantee for affordable housing.
These are two new policies in regards to the housing of urban residents and the
permanent urban population.
你刚才提到，大城市，房价比较高的城市，农民怎么买得起房的问题。我想这个事情可以分两步说。当然会有一部分富起来的农民进城，他们不用你操心，你买不起的房子，他恐怕都买得起。政府应该重点关注的是既在城里落户，都乐业了，政府要想办法实现他们的安居问题。如果没有安居，他住不下，留不下的话，乐业也就是几天的事，乐不长久。我们要解决他有一个稳定的和满足他基本生活需求的一个居所，进而逐步推动他持续乐业，就是把农民转成市民。
You also mentioned the question
of housing affordability for farmers in big cities and cities with relatively
higher housing prices. Actually there are two types of migrant farmers. Your
question doesn’t concern those who have already amassed their fortunes. The
focus of our government will be on those migrant workers who have worked in
cities for quite a period of time, but without a stable home. Their housing
needs should be met and guaranteed by the government.
房价的问题，对于进城的农民来说，在许多大城市当中都是过不去的坎儿。因此在我们新型城镇化规划当中专门有一章，第26章，叫健全城镇住房制度。在这个制度设计当中，我们提出了几个原则，叫市场配置资源和政府保障相结合，以市场为主，来推动形成总量基本平衡。第一个总量基本平衡，是指供求关系平衡。第二个是结构基本合理。结构基本合理的含义就比较宽泛了，既有商品房的供应，也有保障性房建设。对于一些既不属于保障对象，因为他的收入或其他方面不是低收入和中等偏下收入，但是他确实还买不起商品房，对于这一类的群体，我们提出要建设供应政策性商品住房。也就是说要发展共有产权住房，即在一定时期内实行共有产权，政府和购房者共有产权，通过这样的模式，来解决买不起市场房又不符合住房保障条件的“夹心层”。第三是房价与消费能力相适应。就总体上而言，我们要保证市场平稳，要保证房价与消费者的支付能力相平衡。这里面地区之间可能会有很大的差距。
For rural migrant workers, the
housing prices in many big cities form a setback they cannot overcome.
Therefore, the National Plan on New Urbanization has dedicated an entire
chapter to this. Chapter 26, entitled “Improve the Urban Housing System,” gives
the market a decisive role in resource allocation and gives better play to the
role of the government in helping to realize the general aggregate balance. To
this end, we propose several principles. The first is a general aggregate balance,
referring to the balance of supply and demand.
The second is an appropriate
structure of housing supply. This means there will be supplies of both
commercial and indemnificatory housing. And for those who neither meet the
requirements for indemnificatory housing, nor can they afford commercial
housing, we propose developing a type of housing with shared property rights.
In this plan, the government and the house buyer share the ownership of the
house during a given period of time. This will help solve the housing concerns
of China’s so-called “sandwich class.”
The third is to make sure housing
prices match spending power. On the whole, we want to ensure an even market.
But this may differ greatly from area to area.
回答到你刚才的问题，如果进城的农民买不起商品房的话，符合条件他可以走保障房这条路。如果他收入也相对高一些，不符合保障条件，但是够不上市场，中间共有产权住房这个品种就可能会再覆盖相当一批。这个政策不单单覆盖农民工，也包括从其他地方移居到大城市当中的新就业人口。我们总体的设计是这样一个考虑。
For rural migrant workers who
cannot afford commercial housing, if they are qualified, they can apply for
indemnificatory housing; if they do not qualify for indemnificatory housing,
the new model of commercial housing with shared ownership will become a choice
for many of them. This policy covers not only rural migrant workers, but also
new urban residents moving into the big cities from other places. |
